Curse

Fitz Rinley · Oct 05, 2007, 05:38 PM // 17:38

One of the problems I have with the Loot Scaling and all decent drops shipped to Hard Mode and Elite Areas breaks the promise GW is supposed to also be for casual gamers. Hard Mode/Elite players are supposed to be playing Hard Mode and Elite areas because they want something challenging - not because they want to define themselves as worth more than casual players. Nor should hard mode/elite players be holding highend items in ransom from casual players saying, "cough up 100k plus 50 ecto or your just not worthy of my effort."

Out of 10 game characters, I have one almost completely thru the three basic games, and bouncing around GWEN. I have others that are at various stages of the other games, (except my Leg Surv and my LDoA condidates who I only play when I feel like being board to death with the stupidity required for those titles).

This is something I hope they avoid in GW2.

If people want normal, hard, harder, hardest, and not in your wildest dreams ever modes - that is fine. But those who want to casually play the game should never have been punished because they did not want to play hard mode. (Or in the case of some handicapped players because they couldnt.)

Yichi · Oct 05, 2007, 05:40 PM // 17:40

yes because the high end rare drops in the end game areas should be available to the guy right outside the starter town....

EPO Bot · Oct 05, 2007, 05:42 PM // 17:42

Use collector weapons and Droks/Kaineng/Sanctuary armor and you are golden.

There really isn't any other answer to give.

dont feel no pain · Oct 05, 2007, 05:42 PM // 17:42

I think you mean you want gw2 to be more balanced than gw1, probably more balanced, but it'll never perfect.

Bouldershoulder · Oct 05, 2007, 05:48 PM // 17:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fitz Rinley

One of the problems I have with the Loot Scaling and all decent drops shipped to Hard Mode and Elite Areas breaks the promise GW is supposed to also be for casual gamers. Hard Mode/Elite players are supposed to be playing Hard Mode and Elite areas because they want something challenging - not because they want to define themselves as worth more than casual players. Nor should hard mode/elite players be holding highend items in ransom from casual players saying, "cough up 100k plus 50 ecto or your just not worthy of my effort."

If people want normal, hard, harder, hardest, and not in your wildest dreams ever modes - that is fine. But those who want to casually play the game should never have been punished because they did not want to play hard mode. (Or in the case of some handicapped players because they couldnt.)

Hard Mode is meant to scale all regions of the game to the ability of a level 20 and his/her party. There is nothing necessarily elite going on here. If you have trouble defeating the enemies in Hard mode, then you should just rezone and come up with a finely-tuned build. Your build might cut it in Normal mode, but Hard mode is meant to challenge you. Just because it is somewhat hard (...), doesn't mean it is for Elite players only. I myself am a casual player, and I find really nice drops both in and out of HM.

Another thing, that whole "holding of the super awesome items" thing is a bit dramatic. They got their items out of the luck of the draw. It goes for everything. Who's to know if you spend 10 minutes in HM in the Desolation and score yourself a perfect Elemental Sword? Highend items aren't always the product of a half-day of play.

MudBone · Oct 05, 2007, 06:13 PM // 18:13

I have played since Propecies to GW:EN and have beat all 3 campaigns plus expansion

(lots more able to do) and have NEVER gotten an uber drop

, although I have gotten a few greens(nothing special) and perfect golds that I just salvaged the mods off of to sell/use. I'm sure it's because I have Henched(pre-NF) or Hero/Henched(post-NF) 90%+

of the quests/missions being the H/H share in the drops

.
This said I have seen no difference in the quality of drops in Hard Mode other than the assorted profession Tomes and it being unrealistically hard in some areas

.

Darksun · Oct 05, 2007, 06:37 PM // 18:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fitz Rinley

One of the problems I have with the Loot Scaling and all decent drops shipped to Hard Mode and Elite Areas breaks the promise GW is supposed to also be for casual gamers.

Sorry, but there are WAY too many max collectors/merch items to say that you "need" a 100k item.

Mordakai · Oct 05, 2007, 06:44 PM // 18:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fitz Rinley

One of the problems I have with the Loot Scaling and all decent drops shipped to Hard Mode and Elite Areas breaks the promise GW is supposed to also be for casual gamers.

I'd argue that farmers are not casual gamers...

I just play the game with heros/henchies and my drops have not been effected one iota.

If anything, the free chests in Nightfall, the massive amounts of greens floating around, and expanding "rare" skin drops to GWEN have all made casual player have more access to weapons then back in the Prophecy only days!

IslandHermet · Oct 05, 2007, 06:49 PM // 18:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fitz Rinley

One of the problems I have with the Loot Scaling and all decent drops shipped to Hard Mode and Elite Areas breaks the promise GW is supposed to also be for casual gamers. Hard Mode/Elite players are supposed to be playing Hard Mode and Elite areas because they want something challenging - not because they want to define themselves as worth more than casual players. Nor should hard mode/elite players be holding highend items in ransom from casual players saying, "cough up 100k plus 50 ecto or your just not worthy of my effort."

Out of 10 game characters, I have one almost completely thru the three basic games, and bouncing around GWEN. I have others that are at various stages of the other games, (except my Leg Surv and my LDoA condidates who I only play when I feel like being board to death with the stupidity required for those titles).

This is something I hope they avoid in GW2.

If people want normal, hard, harder, hardest, and not in your wildest dreams ever modes - that is fine. But those who want to casually play the game should never have been punished because they did not want to play hard mode. (Or in the case of some handicapped players because they couldnt.)

sorry you feel that way hate to burst your bubble but hard mode is not that hard and if you feel that it is change the build your useing and if you dont know other builds than your in the catorgory of a newbie/starter player useing the same build in every area not noticeing that hey this area is heavy in hexs or this area is heavy in conditions and change accordingly.

HIT F10 FOR THE BEST THING YOU WILL EVER USE IT SHOWS THE LAST SKILLS USED AGAINST YOU AS WELL AS LAST AREA VISITED AND LAST PARTY MEMBERS I use this feature to litterly stroll through Hard mode.
and the im too poor to afford the high end items argue does not help your argument, we were all poor when we started, here is a tip use 1 of the 10 chars you say you have and go SOLO FARMING every character has their best/easy solo spots to make mass money, If you say you are in GW:EN than use a Ele or Warrior to solo farm the first wave of destroyers in the glints challenge mission that will yeald you 2-7 cores a run. Or Solo or Dual run the UW with a friend get good at it and start a spider capping service like me that will yeald you more money in a hour than you probley have ever earned doing anything else. spider capping=20k per spider you should beable to get 2 if your new to the UW Pro spider cappers get 4 spiders a run thats 80k+ecto drops split in half.

Dont post just because you havent figured out a way to make money or are still to new to make your own builds or even know how to counter certian builds and skills, PvE is very very easy even in hard mode if you are still haveing problems rune out your heros thats 1 problem i see with people doing H/H groups and wondering why they fail or die so fast, a runed monk runed up like a PVP monk 60+ energy 500+health and +4 to main Attributes +50 to health rune +1 rune in second dairy atrributes will do tremendsly that your stock monks with 30 energy and 400 health and no + attribute runes and no vigor runes, Yes it cost money but if you want to make money you must spend a little first.

Nor should hard mode/elite players be holding highend items in ransom from casual players saying, "cough up 100k plus 50 ecto or your just not worthy of my effort."
^
this is the exact reason people ingnore you if you think a item you have never seen before or even know where it drops is not worth that than you go find/farm for it OOO wait YOU CANT thats why it is so pricey not alot of people can farm for them Rare drops are Rare for a reason and expensive for the reason they are so rare.

Yes Bad spelling and Grammer are present but this is a forum and not a English class.

unienaule · Oct 05, 2007, 06:54 PM // 18:54

Getting max equipment is easy.

Getting rare skins is a rare occurence, hence the name. If they dropped all the time, they wouldn't be rare. Since they don't affect your gameplay IN THE TINIEST BIT, how exactly does this punish casual players?

Fitz Rinley · Oct 05, 2007, 07:02 PM // 19:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by EPO Bot

Use collector weapons and Droks/Kaineng/Sanctuary armor and you are golden.
There really isn't any other answer to give.

No I am not golden. In fact it is white. And I do not really care that it is white or gold, but I don't particularly like looking at the purple any longer than I have to and the green is an eye-sore. However, I - and any other role player - wants the image of their character to fit the role they themselves imagine for them. So, what you are saying is that I can get any skin and any style that will fit my play at any collector, and then use any insignia I want on said collector armor that comes in any style I want? Or that I can just romp up to a collector and get a Cockatrice Spawning 20/20 stave? If I can't do that then the collectors only have things that are merely tolerable.

A video game is Only about what you see.

[/QUOTE=dont feel no pain]I think you mean you want gw2 to be more balanced than gw1, probably more balanced, but it'll never perfect.[/QUOTE]Something like that. When some players say, "We want a more challenging area of game play," that is great. When it is, "We want a more challenging area of game play with exclusive items, double value gold drops, twice the chance of any decent drops others can get, and special rewards," then they are liars to say what they want is a challenge. And no, a person does not deserve a higher reward for a challenge they asked for. To seek or expect such is ill-mannered.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bouldershoulder

Hard Mode is meant to scale all regions of the game to the ability of a level 20 and his/her party. There is nothing necessarily elite going on here. If you have trouble defeating the enemies in Hard mode, then you should just rezone and come up with a finely-tuned build. Your build might cut it in Normal mode, but Hard mode is meant to challenge you. Just because it is somewhat hard (...), doesn't mean it is for Elite players only. I myself am a casual player, and I find really nice drops both in and out of HM.

There is nothing about changing builds that is going to make massive touch AoE from 16-20 inseparable foe merely a challenge.

Quote:

Another thing, that whole "holding of the super awesome items" thing is a bit dramatic. They got their items out of the luck of the draw. It goes for everything. Who's to know if you spend 10 minutes in HM in the Desolation and score yourself a perfect Elemental Sword? Highend items aren't always the product of a half-day of play.

Well, I know that spending days with one hero healer farming gaki for one Skull Juju couldn't get one. I will accept the luck of the draw theory only so far as I also accept the game is hacked, botted, and e-bayed. And no, I do not believe an honest player, and especially an honest casual player, has a chance.

I have one green on one character that I like to use. That is Moteh's Lightening Spire, which happened to drop when I was capping him. I have and use Asterius Scythe because I dont have anything better for my Derv. I dont like the stats, only the skin, and can't get what I want. I do have Alem's Remedy on my Rit but hardly ever use it because she is mostly set for channeling, but it is ok. I have a couple of other useless greens, which most greens are useless, ugly, or both.

And I will say you are right, the time I spend in hard mode - farming LB and SS points because I have no other option, I do not get anything worth while. Only blues and whites and a pittance of gold. If they didnt want us farming the areas then they shouldnt have set the point levels for achievement so ridiculously high. I have other characters in game to work on besides this bullshit grind fest they keep imposing. (And if I get everything else done with them then the grind fest is all I will have left

.)

MistressYichi, quit being foolish. As an example: I am on my way to fight Shiro and the Lich, a gold drops! Whatever could it be? Why ofcourse, it is a machete (req 10) 14-20 Poisonous, 19% vs Skeletons. How wonderfully useless. Ok, merch for about 200. That is our gold drop for three days.

Fitz Rinley · Oct 05, 2007, 07:07 PM // 19:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by unienaule

Getting max equipment is easy.

Getting rare skins is a rare occurence, hence the name. If they dropped all the time, they wouldn't be rare. Since they don't affect your gameplay IN THE TINIEST BIT, how exactly does this punish casual players?

A video game is about VIDEO. It is not that you are going to die it is that you are going to be the proper expression of the character when you do. The clothes make the man. If the character does not have the skins/appearance that make the entertainment for the player then that VIDEO game fails in the first and most basic category of VIDEO.

freekedoutfish · Oct 05, 2007, 07:14 PM // 19:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fitz Rinley

One of the problems I have with the Loot Scaling and all decent drops shipped to Hard Mode and Elite Areas breaks the promise GW is supposed to also be for casual gamers. ...

Why would a casual player be bothered about loot scaling or better drops in hard mode?

Its only hardcore playes who incist on having hordes of gold to buy the latest green weapon or the l33test armor. Your casual player is just bothered about playing in their spare time to relax.

A casual player is more then capable of making enough gold from drops, to purchase armor (normal or elite) and weapons (gold or green). Loot scaling and better drops in HM hasnt impacted the casual playes ability to play and surive at all.

Loot scaling and better drops in HM infact hasnt impacted anyone, aside from those players who insist on being oober rich. Something you simply dont need to be, to play this game. Its purely an ego trip!

Even so, you can access HM by very simply completing the last mission of a campaign or if one of your existing characters has done that.

Most players (casual or hardcore) will very easily get access to HM, so whats wrong with the better drops being there? They just need to farm the training zones in HM, where less creatures exist! Its not rocket science. No one is stopping casual players from doing HM, and HM isnt that hard.

Besides, what is wrong with rewarding someone better for playing a game in a harder setting?

Do you complain that in a FPS you might get better rewards on a harder setting? No!

Why? Because there is no one to show off to! This idea of having to have lots and lots of gold ingame, only exists because its an MMO and everyone naturally wants to be more impressive then the player next to them in an MMO. If this was an offline game, and you got better drops on hard settings, you wouldnt be bothered because no one can see you.

But just because your ego is broozed because Joe Blogg gets better drops in HM, then you is no reason to let you have the same drops in NM.

redant751 · Oct 05, 2007, 07:16 PM // 19:16

They are called Rare/high end for a reason because they are HARD TO Get.If You sound like you want every thing handed to you,Just like real life you have to put effort in to this game to get some thing out of it,be it titles, equipment or armor. sorry but your rant just dose not hold watter.

I used Blues for the longest times,did all 3 chapters with near perfect weapons/greens and it did not affect my game play in any way.

Didn't want to sound harsh but there was no other way to say it.....

Saphrium · Oct 05, 2007, 07:22 PM // 19:22

Walk back 3 steps, you will feel so much easier to breath.

This is life, don't go for the best of everything, the benefit vs cost is too great to be enjoyable.

arcady · Oct 05, 2007, 07:32 PM // 19:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mordakai

I'd argue that farmers are not casual gamers...

I would agree with you.

You simply cannot get more hardcore than farming. A person who voluntarily grinds in a place that they have already completed for no 'game completion purpose' (like a GW title or like in WoW with its quests to kill 1001 fishmen), but merely to amass more coinage / gear - that's hardcore.

A casual player pretty much does have this game handed to them.

- I've got max stat armor on all my level 20s. as soon as I reached Lion's Arch on a Ch1 char (and jumped to Kaineng/Consulate), or Consulate Docks or Kaineng I had access to the best gear in the game. Not the best looking always (though for elementalists, monks, and necromancers - consulate docks is the end of your armor search in my book), but the stats were there.

- Max stat weapons is another matter, but I have passed collectors handing it out and merchants selling it by the time I reached each of those three spots.

Because I joined GW a little late, I bought the game of the year edition, the only one in the store where I bought it at the time, and that gave me max stat weapons for every core class. And I can create new copies of those weapons everytime I type /bonus - and then hand out the copies to all my heroes (who can use items customized for me). But even with that, I've had nearly as good of weapons drop randomly. That does mean that every Koss I have uses a hammer, and every Olias has at least 9 curses, and for Jin I always focus on Marksmanship - but being more or less casual that's no bother for me.

The biggest thing a casual player misses out on is elite skills. If you're a true casual player you aren't farming elite skills. So in this regard I'm no longer casual...

If you just play through the quests and missions, you're going to miss those, even though often after getting one I've gone right back to a non-elite build after realizing the elite just wasn't as good with any of the skill combos I had as I had hoped it would be...

o m g pizowned · Oct 05, 2007, 07:33 PM // 19:33

why would people play if there was nothing to work for? it wouldn't be fun now would it

MagmaRed · Oct 05, 2007, 07:35 PM // 19:35

Fitz wants to play casually, but look like a 'hardcore' gamer that has the 'fancy' weapons/armor. I can understand that, but you have to understand something yourself Fitz. The 'fancy' items are fancy mainly because they are rare. They are made rare because Anet deemed them to be an item many people would want, so to make them 'special', they made them hard to get. You can function EXACTLY the same as a person who plays 8 hours a day, 7 days a week, and has done so for the last 2+ years. You won't look as 'cool' as they will maybe, but looks and function are completely seperate in this game.

If you want to look cool, then you have to either spend the time to get the 'cool' items, or the money to buy them. If it was easy to get the rare items that look cool, everybody would have them, and nobody would think they looked cool anymore.

The Crystaline Sword is one of the rarest items in the game, and one of the most expensive. I, however, think it is one of the ugliest. My favorite sword skin is the Jade sword, and it is also rare, just not as rare as the Crystaline. Because I have only had 4 drop for me total, only 1 of which was gold, and with a high requirement and bad mods, I bought one. I didn't want to spend 100k on a weapon, but most Jade Swords with the stats I wanted were being sold for that much. Eventually I found a seller for a price I was willing to pay, and bought a Sword with stats I wanted for 80k. Yes, it was expensive, and it took me time to gain the money. But since it made me look cool, I didn't care.

Now, a 'casual' player, as you mentioned, will not be playing often. They will not have large sums of money to buy items they want either. However, the game has never been about how you look. It has always been about how you play. The notion of looking cool is all player driven, and has NO impact on how the game is played. If you want to look cool, please do so. If you want to play well, please do so. But note, making the 'cool looking' items easy to get will make them become less appealing, and you'll not care about them anymore.

Healers Wisper · Oct 05, 2007, 07:50 PM // 19:50

This thread fails... damn communist.

Look work hard, dedicate time, earn something. I know that sounds like its unfair and bad and all that, but hell, it feels better when you scrimp and save and collect enough money and materials to get your first Elite armor. At least it did for me cause I earned it. Stop whinning cause everything isn't handed to you on a silver platter. We all started broke, in fact I still am 15K in storage I belive. We all farmed, got our butts kicked in HM till we figured it out, spent money for armor and builds and skills and such. It is amazing how easy it is to earn money when you have spent enough to make decent builds and have heros that dont die.

Get over yourself, this game would be crap if the bugs outside the monestary dropped Ele swords.

MSecorsky · Oct 05, 2007, 08:01 PM // 20:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fitz Rinley

No I am not golden. In fact it is white.

Well you see... that proves you spend too much time playing and need to get out in the sun more. Golden you right up.